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Cheap cartridges for developers and gamers


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#61 Zerosquare

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Posted 09 October 2010 - 12:46 PM

CITATION(Tyr of the Arcana @ 9 Oct 2010, 09:21) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just a shame so much is in French, but that's mostly the old stuff.
Yes, we try to use English now. If you need help to understand an older topic, just ask wink.gif
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#62 Tyrant

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 09:11 PM

How's this project coming along? I'd love to get my hands on a couple of these carts right now, and then a big batch of them sometime down the line.

When will you be able to give us a better estimation of the cost of them? Also I believe something was mentioned about cart shells, would be nice to get more details on that too.

Thanks.
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Aka Tyrant

#63 Zerosquare

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 12:04 AM

I (finally !) got a quote from the manufacturer a few days ago. There's a 358.80€ fixed cost (regardless of the number of carts manufactured) to set up the production, plus 28.11€ per board for the parts, PCB manufacturing and soldering ; it goes down to 25.12€ per board if we get more than 200 boards manufactured. The price still isn't 100% sure, because the company has to consult the PCB supplier to know if the silver/gold plating and beveled edges are going to add an extra cost ; that's why I hadn't announced it publicly yet.

One of our Reboot friends has bought a large number of carts shells ; depending on how many people order one, the price should be about 2 or 3 euros.

So, assuming the prices are final, one cart + shell would cost 35€ if we get 100 of them manufactured, 30€ if we get 200 of them manufactured, and probably less for more.
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#64 Tursi

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 02:29 AM

That's sounding pretty realistic now, good stuff!

#65 JustClaws

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Posted 18 December 2010 - 01:58 PM

Hi all,
This looks like a great product.
Thanks for the effort there.
Richard / JustClaws.
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#66 Clint Thompson

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 11:11 AM

Hi all....

So cool to see fascinating hardware developments make way to the Jaguar.
Any news on this and how it's coming along? I've noticed it has been a few months. smile.gif

Thanks
Clint

#67 Zerosquare

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 09:38 PM

The project is "on hold" at the moment, due to myself getting a new job that takes a lot of time, and problems with the manufacturer I had previously chosen.
I'll restart it as soon as I can smile.gif
« Mon PC on dirait un Amiga tellement c'est instable » – GT Turbo
« Soit A un niveau d'absurdité, il existe un post N tel que... » – Azrael et al., 2006

#68 Clint Thompson

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 12:05 PM

Sounds good smile.gif

#69 ChupaX

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Posted 09 July 2012 - 12:45 PM

Hey Zerosquare! Are you still making these Flash Carts?
I'd be interested in one from the USA.
Thanks,Eric

#70 Zerosquare

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Posted 09 July 2012 - 10:55 PM

We've not released them yet, but we probably will in the following months smile.gif
« Mon PC on dirait un Amiga tellement c'est instable » – GT Turbo
« Soit A un niveau d'absurdité, il existe un post N tel que... » – Azrael et al., 2006

#71 TXG/MNX

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 02:56 PM

QUOTE (Zerosquare @ 9 Jul 2012, 22:55) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We've not released them yet, but we probably will in the following months smile.gif


Any news when the release of these carts will be ?

#72 Zerosquare

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 04:43 AM

Soon... oh wait, that's what I said last time already wink.gif

The technical details have been sorted out, so as soon as the money is collected, we're good to go with mass production of the first Jagtopus-based games. When this will happen is up to game developers to tell me tongue.gif
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« Soit A un niveau d'absurdité, il existe un post N tel que... » – Azrael et al., 2006

#73 isolomon6

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Posted 01 March 2013 - 10:47 PM

Looking forward to hearing more news in regards to this. smile.gif

#74 sh3-rg

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Posted 04 June 2013 - 09:25 PM

You may have heard about SCPCD's 4-way cart programmer - it's a device intended for devs/publishers to allow them to rapidly produce Jaguar games on flash cartridges (for the moment, this means Jagtopus).

I made a video of the programmer in action, check it out here.
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#75 TXG/MNX

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 02:57 PM

QUOTE (sh3-rg @ 4 Jun 2013, 22:25) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You may have heard about SCPCD's 4-way cart programmer - it's a device intended for devs/publishers to allow them to rapidly produce Jaguar games on flash cartridges (for the moment, this means Jagtopus).

I made a video of the programmer in action, check it out here.


Hi looking good, any date when final price of the flashcards and programmer wil be released ?

#76 sh3-rg

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 03:05 PM

QUOTE (TXG/MNX @ 5 Jun 2013, 14:57) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE (sh3-rg @ 4 Jun 2013, 22:25) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You may have heard about SCPCD's 4-way cart programmer - it's a device intended for devs/publishers to allow them to rapidly produce Jaguar games on flash cartridges (for the moment, this means Jagtopus).

I made a video of the programmer in action, check it out here.


Hi looking good, any date when final price of the flashcards and programmer wil be released ?


The programmer is an internal only tool, nobody would want to buy one if they had to pay what it cost for parts and labour :-)

As for end user carts to be BJL flashed (or whatever) - that's something people will have to really demand in numbers and convince those guys that there is sufficient demand to make it happen. Support, testing, logistics, finances... it's all a lot of hassle if only a handful of people would use them and a few more just wanted them to stick in a box with everything else.

Skunkboard is still the way to go for devving stuff - faster, simpler, rock solid. If people have a game they want to put out, maybe they should talk to SCPCD, Zero, RGC or RGCD.
Would you Push The Button?
"Do not trust people who offer incense" - zerosquare offering some important advice via google translate

#77 Clint Thompson

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Posted 24 June 2014 - 04:21 AM

A few questions:

1. What is the disadvantage of only have a 16-bit bus access oppose to the standard 32-bit real cartridges use? Will it be slower at loading/accessing?
2. I didn't see an answer posted in regards to using sizes above 4MB. Would this require some sort of multi-banking or is 6MB+ actually possible rather easily?



#78 SCPCD

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Posted 24 June 2014 - 08:40 AM

CITATION(Clint Thompson @ 24 Jun 2014, 05:21) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A few questions:

1. What is the disadvantage of only have a 16-bit bus access oppose to the standard 32-bit real cartridges use? Will it be slower at loading/accessing?

Standard jaguar cartridge is 32-bit in 10 clock cycles speed.
New generation cartridge with flash memory in 16-bit works in 5 clock cycles.
So we can say that the throughput is almost the same.
CITATION
2. I didn't see an answer posted in regards to using sizes above 4MB. Would this require some sort of multi-banking or is 6MB+ actually possible rather easily?

The Jaguar ROM address space is limited to a direct 6MB, to use more memory, you need external hardware to do software bankswitching with, for example, logical device, PAL, GAL or CPLD.


Nyan ! :P

#79 Clint Thompson

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 10:42 PM

Thanks for the response.

Reading in the FAQs, I know the Jaguar could access at very least (externally) 2MB additional RAM, though one FAQ I came across said it could access up to 8MB (though I don't ever recall that being the case the whole time I've been into the Jaguar). Everyone is going out of their way for cartridge solutions but no one has (that I"m aware of) attempted to integrate the idea of adding more on-board RAM to be accessed via the cartridge (whether it be 2MB or 8MB, permitting that is even possible). Are there no readily available chips able to be used to do this? I'm guessing the cutdown to 16-bit access from 32-bit could pose a problem but isn't there a way aound that as well?

#80 Zerosquare

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 12:34 AM

The maximum amount of memory that can be mapped in the cartridge space is not 8 MB, but only 6 MB, because the upper 2 MB are reserved for things like the boot ROM, GPU/DSP RAM and hardware registers.

You could have on-cart RAM, but:
- if it's SRAM, suitable chips are probably expensive
- if it's DRAM, you'd need a FPGA or memory controller to manage it
- the performance will be limited because of the cartridge timings (at best 5 clock cycles per R/W access).
- the performance will be limited because of the cartridge bus width (at best 32 bits, but that would require several SRAM chips, or a FPGA with lots of pins, plus voltage translators)

Basically it's doable but not cheap, and it would be significantly slower than internal RAM.
« Mon PC on dirait un Amiga tellement c'est instable » – GT Turbo
« Soit A un niveau d'absurdité, il existe un post N tel que... » – Azrael et al., 2006



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